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Liroconite : Cu2Al(AsO4)(OH)4·4H2O

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Copyright © National Museum of Ireland
 
 
 
 
 
minID: 7FK-LTF

Liroconite : Cu2Al(AsO4)(OH)4·4H2O

Copyright © National Museum of Ireland  - This image is copyrighted. Unauthorized reproduction prohibited.
Dimensions: 50 mm x 30 mm x 20 mm

Extremely rare specimen of liroconite (?) from Avoca. Whether this specimen is liroconite or not is unclear (see below excerpt).

Specimen label notes "Sulphate of copper (on quartz vein) resulting from the decomposition of copper pyrites from Connoree Mines, 60ft level. Presented by Mr Mahon Esq, Vale of Avoca, Wicklow".


Excerpt statement from the UCD collection curation team:

The 'chalcanthite' of the previous post isn't! It has all the hallmarks of being liroconite. The crystal habit (pseudotetragonal flattened octahedral bipyramids - see first photo) and the fact that it does not dissolve in luke warm water (second photo), plus the colour, all say 'liroconite', not chalcanthite. The labels on the specimen and the tray (see last three photos) all correlate [the first, oldest - likely early to mid 19thC - label reads "Sulphate of copper (on quartz vein) resulting from the decomposition of copper pyrites from Connoree Mines, 60ft level. Presented by Mr Mahon Esq, Vale of Avoca, Wicklow" and the label has been overwritten later with "Chalcanthite", this being used in a later separate label on early 20thC paper/card; and the number '383' is a now-lost catalogue number, but it does correlate between specimen and labels and there are no other 383s to be seen in the collection - thus far!].

But we still have work to do! Compare the nature (paragenesis) of this specimen with material from Avoca and from Cornwall, which is where most liroconite comes from. Compare the UCD specimen with old specimens of Avoca 'chalcanthite' that are in the National Museum of Ireland (excepting modern material from Stephen Moreton, who knows his mineralogical onions). Doing a basic chemical analysis (just for confirmation - the crystal shape etc are very diagnostic).

As I write, there are two possibilities: first, this is the first occurrence of liroconite from Ireland; second, this is a Cornwall specimen that perhaps Mr Mahon used to 'enhance' the evidence of copper from Connoree mines. However, there are plenty of copper minerals in the area, so why fraudulently import a rare specimen and pass it off as from the Avoca area? Liroconite contains arsenic, whereas chalcanthite does not, and there are, in fact, old reports of arsenic from Connoree, even if this element mostly absent from surrounding areas, which would support a local origin. At the moment, we just can't say which scenario is correct. But it will be thrilling to find out!

This photo has been shown 470 times
Photo added:2nd Dec 2016
Dimensions:3136x2056px (6.45 megapixels)
Camera:CANON EOS 550D / Rebel T2i / Kiss X4

Data Identifiers

Mindat Photo ID:789178 📋 (quote this with any query about this photo)
Long-form Identifier:mindat:1:4:789178:3 📋
GUID:e3c7228d-70ab-4229-9748-b48d7f01052b 📋
Specimen MinID7FK-LTF (note: this is not unique to this photo, it is unique to the specimen)

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Discuss this Photo

PhotosLiroconite - Connary mine, Avoca, Co. Wicklow, Ireland

13th Jan 2017 14:00 UTCJamison K. Brizendine 🌟 Expert

I am curious to know, if both the mineral and locality are in question here, why is the specimen approved for public galleries?


I would think that a Raman study or even an XRD of a damaged part of this would prove this to be liroconite or something else…

13th Jan 2017 15:25 UTCDale Foster Manager

Whilst I don't specialise in the collecting of copper arsenates I would say, based on the experience I have had with them, that this specimen is a Liroconite and looks strongly reminiscent of the material from either Wheal Gorland or Wheal Unity - immediately neighbouring mines at St Day, Cornwall. There even appears to be hints of possible Olivenite on the rear of the piece.


It would be interesting to hear the views of our fellow Mindat member, Courtenay Smale, who has considerable knowledge of the secondary copper arsenates of Cornwall as to the likely origins of this piece.


Reading the blurb in the caption, I would very much doubt there was any deliberate attempt with this specimen to 'enhance' anything, more like a simple cock-up in labelling at some stage in the past.

16th Jan 2017 16:55 UTCCourtenay Smale

Over many decades of researching the Arsenates of Cornwall, this specimen fits comfortably in my belief that it is a Liroconite from the Gwennap parish in Cornwall, and is probably from Wheal Gorland (including Wheal Muttrell) or, less likely, an adjacent copper mine. The colour, crystal habit, and associated quartz are characteristic of the Liroconite specimens retrieved from the gossan level in the late 1700s and early 1800s.

I have examined hundreds of Liroconites from Gwennap over a long time and there is little to suggest that this example does not conform to the Gwennap material.


Addressing the two possibilities that (1) it is a first occurance of Liroconite from Ireland and (2) that it might have been used to 'enhance' the evidence of copper from Connoree mines are unlikely candidates. Why anyone should choose to use a Liroconite specimen for that reason would be most naive.


From my personal knowledge, the parageneses of the Avoca Vale and Gwennap mines are markedly different. Wheal Gorland alone boasts at least 20 different arsenates (Cu, Fe, Pb, U, and Bi) whilst the Avoca area claims just this solitary specimen.


In 1958 I was employed by the Mogul Mining Corp. Toronto, in the trackless mining reopening of St. Patrick's Copper Mine on the west side of the river, concentrating on the Pond Lode and the South Lode. The Company's sett also included land on the east side of the river and I had the opportunity of examining material from both sides.The copper mine's mineralisation comprised predominantly native elements, oxides, and sulphides of Cu, Fe, Pb, and Zn. I have no recollection of encountering any metallic Arsenates on the mine or in the area.


The most likely scenario is that - somewhere along the line - there has been a mix- up and a subsequent mislabelling of the specimen illustrated.
 
and/or  
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