Post Date: March 20, 2013Trip Date: Winter/Summer 2012

Cone In Cone Structures the Geologic Mystery Continues











Following the writing of my original article # 7 titled “Cone in Cone Structures the Geologic Mystery”, I received many many emails from professionals to collectors to the curious. Lots of questions but few answers are available and this is what makes these structures so fascinating.

Before reading this article/story, I would suggest you read or refresh your memory with the original # 7 article. The original contains valuable information pertaining to these structures but only a fraction of the material that is available. Those interested should research independently and use my material as reference only.

This article will contain little to no new addition geologic information as compared to the original. Here, I only wish to answer one of the foremost questions put to me. The question is “Have I located any additional sites”.

Though my answer will sound ambiguous, it says it all, “yes and no”. I have located and explored two additional cone in cone sites since the first article was published. I was able to locate these sites, only through the efforts of those who have emailed me and given me directions to these sites. Prior to reading my first article, two men, both from the Erie County, Pa. USA region, where the first discovery was made, were aware of these structures. These two men whose identities are unknown to each other, independently located the first article online and contacted me with their stories.

Like many, myself included, have rarely if ever heard of these structures let alone seen them. Cone in cone structures are not glamorous shiny gemstones. On the contrary, just the opposite, composition wise they are sedimentary in nature containing ground particles of rock, mineral and clay particles. Some have been found composed of gypsum, siderite and even coal. Conical, tapering, fossil looking, cemented in a specific rock layer unimposing and unassuming structures.

After my first collecting trip for cone in cone structures, I realized if there were one outcrop then surely there had to be more. This idea led me on an adventure of discovery. I live approx. one hundred and some odd miles from Erie County, Pa. a distance to great to be able to physically explore in real time. Other options included hours worth of Internet searches and library time. A second option was to write to the Pennsylvania Geological Survey. Certainly a state agency with the word “Geological” in its name would have information concerning cone in cone structures, outcrops, maps, photos and/or their whereabouts. The survey has a website and a “click on” button to contact them. I typed out a nice email pertaining to the nature of my request and clicked on the contact button. After only a few days a reply arrived at my web mail address. I was excited to say the least. It is my nature to ask questions so this email was not something out of my regular routine while gathering information. When I receive informational replies and before reading the mail, my eyes always travel to the bottom of the letter where the writer signs the mail. I want to know who the email is from and their professional qualifications. This email reply was signed and stated the writer was in fact a state geologist.

Sadly enough however, the reply did not contain the information I sought. It offered no help with cone in cone structures, no maps, no outcrop listings, no photos, pretty much no information. Except for the writer to say he did hunt for the structures when in college. No harm done, the writer just was just not the person to answer my letter. It happens.

Should a representative of this state (Pennsylvania) read this article and have information pertaining to cone in cone outcrops in the state, would it be asking to much to contact me. Please do not email me with an attitude in defense of geologists. I am emphatically stating there is no malice toward any one or any profession, simply telling a story the way it transpired.

And, for that matter, should anyone out there know of an outcrop in the state please contact me. I realize collecting sites are sometimes kept secret. I do the same myself for obvious reasons. I do not and will not reveal such sites, as this article will prove.

It was early winter (2012) when I received the email from Aaron. My excitement level hit the ceiling as I read his story. Here was a man, who when younger used to go down to the “swimming hole” on the hot summer days. He stated he read my first article and wanted to contact me. He did indeed find, on the opposite side of a creek, the structures described in my first article. I immediately replied asking if it would be possible to meet and be shown the site. He hadn’t been to the site in years but was very willing to supply me with directions, which he did.

Using “Google Earth”, the satellite views are unparalleled for using directions when buildings and landmarks are being employed, I was able to localize the area described to me. I copied the view added grid lines and emailed the view back to Aaron. The use of the grid marks worked beautifully, Aaron zoomed right in on where he thought the structures used to be.


It was several weeks later when, like always, my son and faithful rock hound companion, now 19 years old, a volunteer firefighter and soon a college boy, decided on a date to make the trip. Winter is defiantly not the time to travel north and Erie is north of where we live.








The day chosen for our trip may not have been the best day. The weather service was calling for snow from 1 to 3 inches for the Pittsburgh, Pa. area and up to 12 inches for the Erie, Pa. area. We had already made plans, packed gear and had the truck loaded the night before. I was just a bit nervous knowing the weather forecast

I own a small cottage on Pymatuning Lake close to Erie. Even though the weather forecast was not promising, should worse come to worse all we had to do would be to get to the cottage. We were planning a 2-3 day trip, staying at the cottage. Normally the drive up takes about 2 hours. The snow quickly turned to a major winter storm. Blizzard like conditions caused visibility to be near zero, as the photo shows. The drive was a white-knuckle nerve-racking 4 hour drive. I can say I was relieved when we arrived at our destination.












With the air temperature leveling out around zero degrees, we drove into the yard, around the cottage and unloaded the firewood. It was to cold out to make a campfire. Nighttime was coming soon, we decided to stay indoors, have dinner and watch a movie. After that I was ready for sleep.












Rising at daybreak and not knowing what to expect weather wise, we found all the windows covered with beautiful ice crystals. Probably due to warm moist interior air up against the cold glass. I marveled at each window. If memory serves me correctly….ice is considered a mineral.

With the morning sun rising, it was a stark difference from the day before. Finding only about 3 inches of snow on the ground, we packed up and were off to find the cone in cone. The big question in our minds now was…how much snow lay ahead in Erie.

The drive from the cottage to Lake Erie usually takes 20-30 minutes. Erie is known for high snow accumulations in short periods of time. Weather wise it is called “The Lake Effect”. The Erie area is well equipped for adverse snowy conditions. The snow scrapers were out all night scraping and salting, the roads were in remarkable condition. My worst fears melted away as the sun grew warmer and warmer. Following the GPS, we arrived in a short time. It wasn’t going to be all that easy though. Yes, there was at least 12 inches of snow on the ground up here. With the snowplows active all night clearing the roadways, pulling off the side of the road to park was not an option. Heaps of plowed snow, a foot or more tall, ran parallel to the roadways. We were close to the location but as it was we might as well have been a hundred miles away. Adam drove up and down the road several times as we tried to locate a spot to park. Things were not looking good at this point. We had passed a small area several times that appeared to be a parking spot. Because of its size we continued to look. Finally, we decided to try the small site. It was very close to where we wanted to be. Possibly during the course of the night a snowplow truck may have pulled off the road and did not pile up the snow here. Adam went for it and managed to get us off the road and parked….thank goodness for 4 wheel drive.

The creek was just a short walk away. The snow was up to my knees which is over 12 inches.












Oversight, we were caught off guard, the creek is very high, fast moving water and full of ice. The cone in cone are supposed to be in the rock layers on the opposite side of the creek. There does not appear to be a bank or place on which to stand on the opposite side. A foot of snow is covering the ground and ice is covering the rock layers












We did a short recon upstream and down but were unable to find a safe spot in which to cross the creek. Even if we were able to cross the creek, the rock layers are so tall it would be entirely to risky to climb down to explore.












All these factors influenced my next decision. With the adverse conditions, hazards that would await us should we attempt a crossing, combined with the fact we did not know if there were even cone in cone over there, I decided to retreat in order to fight another day. Safety is always my first, last and only concern. Adam agreed. We abandoned our search and returned to our wehicle.

Summer was only a few months away, we would return. The site is easy enough to find. In fact in the summer the creek probably dries up. What could be better than that? No need risking potential disaster. With the sun still climbing, we had all day for other things. The Erie area offers a variety of sights and activities during any season. With plenty of bottled water, sandwiches and snacks we decided to drive over to Presque Isle. Here is a beautiful place winter or summer.












“In the day” the Erie, Girard areas were known for canals and railroads. Even today a railroad enthusiast would have a great time here. A beautiful modern day engine crosses our path with a very interesting sign posted next to the rail line









Arriving at Presque Isle, we soon found beautiful natural ice sculptures. Presque Isle juts out into Lake Erie. The entire isle is a state park with the roadway laid out following most of the shoreline. The ice sculptures are formed when the temperatures are very low. The wind blowing off the lake picks up moisture and deposits that moisture on the inland plants and trees. The moisture freezes creating a beautiful winter ice land.









Very near the tip of Presque Isle, the United States Coast Guard stands at the ready. No visitors today, the property is fenced in. The gate was closed.













Adam thought I was going to follow him………ha ha ha. I was wondering how he was going to explain to the park patrol.









Near the Coast Guard Station, a waterway connects the bay side of Presque Isle to Lake Erie. A warning light house at the waterway entrance and a concrete mooring array are posted in this waterway. This is a beautiful place to fish from. The top of the mooring area is maybe 6-8 foot above the water. Here it is coated with thick ice……..an extremely dangerous place to walk out on today. That is unless, you brought your slip on shoe ice spikes.



















The isle is surrounded with lengths of barrier rock. These barriers are designed as wave breakers, which help to lessen beach erosion. We spotted an interesting object out on one of the barriers and decided to explore. Ice had formed on a tree or uprooted tree root forming something very unusual.

Natural beauty. It looks almost like an animal in a sitting position, balancing on front legs, head and spine curved and rigid as it howls upward toward the sky.


The Erie area also contains several trout and salmon streams. Here we visited Walnut Creek where the Steelhead Trout and Chinook Salmon run. The fishes leave the safety of the lake waters and fight their way up stream for mating purposes. This is sight to behold. At the height of mating season the streams are absolutely full of fishes.















We finished out the day having lunch, visiting two other migratory creeks and driving down to the cone in cone site in article # 7. This was not a good idea as this area is very rural and roadways were not pretty.

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Months have now passed. It is now summer. The snow is but a mere a memory. The days have gotten longer, warmer and we are back. These photos depict the great contrast from our earlier trip.












Causally walking across ankle deep water, my only fear now is that of running into snakes basking on the warm rocks. At least you don’t see snakes in the winter. The rock layering structure is very similar to that of the first site I discovered.


















I had expected to do a lengthy search but this was unbelievable. There even without searching for them were the cone in cone structures right in front of me. Formed in two very distinct rock layers, an upper layer, a lower layer separated by a void layer. As I can not date the layers, my mind wonders. How did this all come about??? Personally, I do not have the skills needed to answer the detailed questions that have been asked for over a hundred years. And, with only theories abounding there is no definitive answer.










I continued down stream, following the cone in cone layers. The scenic beauty was inspiring. Here was nature in full bloom.

The structures were mud encrusted as seen, probably from spring flooding.












The structure layer/layers were as distinct as the leaves on the trees. It was amazing how they just stood out. People probably see these structures everyday and pay no mind to them at all. Millions of years in the making going unnoticed. Erosion is slowly removing the outward traces. As the front surfaces break and fall off new structures appear and the cycle continues.














Obviously I did not come to collect specimens. I am not wearing the proper clothing, nor am I carrying any type of rock gear. Though a hammer and small chisel would have come in handy. Digital cameras are my tools for today. A camera can capture so much in so little space. The proper type of camera is essential. Both of mine are rated waterproof for fifteen feet beneath the waves and shockproof from a fall of fifteen feet. These features are extremely essential. Remember moisture of any kind is considered water…. dew, rain, ice and snow, condensation. I admit my cameras have fallen on more than one occasion. They have taken a licken and come back fighting. If you do much exploring sooner or later you will understand. Keep the camera strap around your neck.



Right at this point I would like to pause and bring up a subject that is very real. And the reason for me not taking specimens from this or the next site. I have several excellent specimens of cone in cone from the site in my first article. Do I need more specimens??? When out in the field collecting how many specimens are enough, one bucket full, twenty buckets full??? Myself, I collect many individual samples. When I leave a site I leave with 4-8 of the best samples I collected that day. Depending on sample size and attached waste material, grunge say ½ of a bucket full. Anyone who has collected with me can verify this. There are always exceptions to every rule and this is no different. But that is a rarity not the norm. My perspective is conservation of the naturally occurring rocks or minerals. I take just enough. Others see it differently. I personally have seen people ravishing a collecting spot. This type of collecting upsets me and is completely uncalled for. Is there no tomorrow??? Will there be no new rock collectors?? There should be no argument, free, small scale collectable mineral outcrops in the USA are dwindling. If you don’t believe that you are sadly fooling yourself. How many specimens can one display or place in their personal collection? The answer for me is quite simple. But, I am sure I will hear arguments to the contrary. That is fine if that is your position. I personally do not believe in making money from the sale of small scale collecting, nor do I believe in collecting all I find before someone else gets there. It just doesn’t make a whole lot of sense to have twenty buckets full of a particular mineral stashed in the basement hidden under the pool table or out in the garage collecting dust. I understand the mentality behind it, but fail to understand the reasoning. If anyone has seen the TV show about “hoarders” you will see my point. One thing for sure… those inconsiderate of others, those over collecting or carting away more than they need, more than their fair share, sooner or later will be turning mother natures treasures into money. As collecting sources continue to dry up, newer younger collectors will have missed the opportunity to collect in the field. Remember your first trip collecting in the field? Put your stuff on Ebay, those few dollars or thousands of dollars are not worth my memory of my first field collecting trip.





















The lustrous structures were different from the usual. Their composition certainly is different from the rest. Still sedimentary, only tests would reveal their nature. At this site three distinct classes/ structures types are evident, the ultra-fine particle gray structures, the grainy almost sandy like structures and finally the velvety structures. How is this statement… “Sedimentation like a fast moving train, cares not for its individual riders but only to drop them off and deposit them somewhere”.

I have no idea how far I followed the layer, maybe a half mile, maybe more maybe less. It makes no difference. The enjoyment was all mine. A sunny day, green leaves, semi-dried up creek, no snakes, lots of photos. What more does a guy need!



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I welcome any and all emails pertaining to this subject, discussion, criticisms or questions I can answer. For reference I would like to refer to the site in my first article as “Site 1”, the above site as “Site 2” and the next following site as “Site 3”. For obvious reasons I can not give directions to any sites. Mutations do exist in nature



The next outcrop I would like to highlight is again in the Erie County, Pa. region. This site, unlike the first two is not bound by the walls of a creek but instead is directly on the coast of Lake Erie. In fact the rock layers rise up and out of Lake Erie. Waves splash upon these structures each and every day.

Lake Erie as well as all the other “Great Lakes” were formed through glaciation. The Earth experienced several “Ice Ages”. The ice traveling from the very northern regions of the planet advancing and retreating scraped, dug and gouged whatever lay in its relentless path of movement. If one were to side view a diamond encrusted masonry or lapidary circular saw blade, it would be apparent how, what, why the process was so destructive. Imagine a wall of ice embedded with rock, boulders, soil on a massive scale moving against the ground unstoppable. As this mass traveled, whatever was pulled from the surface below it quickly became part of the whole. A perpetual motion machine devouring land masses. For this very same reason, this is what makes a flood, tidal wave or the more massive tsunami so destructive. Yes the force of the water or ice but also the debris carried along.

Here on the North American Continent, billions of cubic yards of rock and soil were ripped from present day Canada. I have rock collected in areas of Ontario where there is basically very little to no soil. Bedrock exposures abound as well as thousands of smaller lakes scraped out of this bedrock. Years and years and years ago as the Canadian government offered land for settling, people were moving in. This same type of migration is similar to the westward expansion in the U.S.A. Settlers looking for a place to call home migrated into Ontario. Many nationalities were represented, as city and town names will attest to. Imagine moving into the middle of the wilderness where you were the only one or family there and finding no grocery stores. Sure this is an extreme view but still true. These original settlers had to hunters, fishermen and farmers.

I love to read stories, accounts and histories (my second passion) as I do for everywhere my collecting leads me to. Because farming was the main staple it was the blood of life. Without blood there is no life. Since entire regions in Ontario were stripped of most of the life giving blood (soil), these settlers were on a collision course with their destinies. Settlers came and left, they came and died. Farms were started and abandoned over and over again. The soil was just too thin to support the needs of the people let alone the needs of farm animals: goats, cattle, horses. Those that stayed and eked out a meager existence. But change was coming. Somewhere along the timeline something happened something recreated the entire mindset. It all had to do with the soil or lack of it.

Because the soil was scrapped so thin and with bedrock exposed over huge areas, mineral deposits were basically laying on the surface. Over the course of years, mining started to replaced and finally overtook farming as the main staple of life. The dirt farmers slowly but most surely turned to mining. From the silver deposits at Cobalt, the gold mines, iron ore, fluorspar and many many other minerals. An entire new industry sprang out of the ground. Led by the common man, hauling mineral wealth from the soil of the old farm to major mining operations employing thousands. Growth and expansion were led by mineral wealth. Even into the early 1940’s with the highly sought after….radioactive minerals. World attention turned to this area.









In the early spring of 2012, I received an email from a man named Craig, who after reading my first cone in cone article contacted me about a site he was familiar with which contain cone in cone structures. Craig who lives in the Erie area and frequents a small beach on the lake made this discovery while engaging in has very unique hobby of collecting smaller metal objects washed up on the beach. He was kind enough to direct me to his find.

The timing of this email was perfect, as I was planning to revisit Aaron’s site. This presented the perfect opportunity to visit two cone in cone sites. So……….after leaving Aaron’s site we drove over to Craig’s site. The day was perfect. We had no problems locating the site. Adam and I had lunch on the beach and after… it was time for cone in cone. Again, I am not collecting specimens. I am carrying a single camera.












From where we were sitting we could see where our path would lead. The ever so familiar rocky-layered hillside lay in wait. From our vantage point this little beach looked like a tropical paradise.









Call it luck, call it make up for the winter trip, call it what you will, I tripped over the cone in cone layer. As seen by the arrow, the cone in cone rock layer was located just below the beach sand. I’ve dug deep holes, climbed hillsides so steep deer would not climb, been ripped apart in thorns and briers, been cut, eaten by mosquitoes and black flies, walked in former radioactive mineral mines but have never tripped on my target. No search needed here, the cones in cone were looking for me.

The site in my first article and the two we explored today are quite a number of miles apart. Could this structure layer be one in the same???? Good question. And, if so, this could lead to farther outcrops.











Walking farther on, the layers slowly begin to rise up out of the sand.









Yes, as is apparent the beach and sand is quickly disappearing. Soon I will be in the water. Only countless layers of watery bedrock are exposed continuing out above the lake forming the hillside. The arrow marks the cone in cone. Eons and eons of sedimentation are right before your eyes. It is unimaginable as to how this all took place. The rock layers were here long before the ice ages came. Here is a thought: remember the ice is carrying with it Canadian material.









Then, a beautiful find, the very distinctive and easily recognizable cone in cone. This photo is an excellent shot of the top of the cone in cone as looking down on the structures, completely different from a side view, which shows the conical shapes. Erosion has carefully removed the upper layers of rock and exposed this mass. And, as erosion continues these structures will disappear soon enough.






















Several feet ahead again the same mass, erosion is eating away at the upper rock layers beautifully exposing these structures. The sight reminded me of watery gray mud oozing out from between the rock layers like something out of a Sci-Fi movie.















These three photos detail the top surface of the structures, ripplely, wavelike.






I have run out of dry land and am continuing in the water as far as I can possibly go. In spots the water is waist deep. Yes, my wallet was in my back pocket. The upper rock layers are no longer eroded away to the same degree as seen earlier. Here all the rock layers including the cone in cone layer is cracking off.








The wave action here is undercutting the rising rock layers creating over hanging ledges. The cone in cone layer is under this ledge.
The next series of photos show water bugs and cone in cone.


































This series of photos are spectacular. The sedimentary material deposited here most certainly is of a different composition then the surrounding rock. Look at the size and color of these cones. The cone color has gone from a grayish material to an almost whitish color. The surrounding rock is still the grayish material.






















The upper most photo is unique in that the upper surface of the rock clearly demonstrates the individual cone tops. And the classic side view on the conical shape. The individual cones are eroding apart. During cold weather, the freeze thaw cycle plays a major role here.


Then as abruptly as it began, the whitish cone in cone stopped and continued with the grayish colored variety.


I continued as far as possible following the structures through and around this undercut curved eroded area. Enough material had become loosened and fallen to have created a small sandy rock lined beach.








As seen in the photo, the arrows indicate the end of my journey. A very large obstacle lay in my path, namely a concrete wall. I was soaked, on the short smooth rock layer I sat and became the undisputed king of all that lay before me. I was the only one there, in my own little rocky paradise, if there were only a palm tree or two it would have been perfect.

Hopefully sometime during the summer of 2013 I would like to explore the possibility of going past the concrete wall from up above or kayaking around the wall and continue tracing the cone in come. It may lead to the fabled “pot of gold” who knows ! ! !

I certainly would like to thank Aaron…maybe I’ll meet you at the “swimming hole” one day.
To Craig for being observant and for contacting me. I have a small collection of Lake Erie beach stuff myself.
And finally, to Josh from the U.K. who asked for a definition and ended up with an entire story. Good luck with your studies.


Thanks for reading

Good luck and good hunting

Frank